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And I think what the pharmaceutical industry can do is help to distribute this medicine. So I spent 12 years looking for that data, eventually found it, of all places, in Catalonia in Spain in this 635-page monograph that was published in 2002 and for one reason or another-- probably because it was written in Catalan-- was not widely reported to the academic community and went largely ignored. BRIAN MURARESKU: Right. And why, if you're right that the church has succeeded in suppressing a psychedelic sacrament and has been peddling instead, what you call a placebo, and that it has exercised a monstrous campaign of persecution against plant medicine and the women who have kept its knowledge alive, why are you still attached to this tradition? Part 1 Brian C. Muraresku: The Eleusinian Mysteries, Discovering the Divine, The Immortality Key, The Pagan Continuity Hypothesis and the Hallucinogenic Origins of Religion - Feb 22, 2023 And so with a revised ancient history, in place Brian tacks back to the title of our series, Psychedelics and the Future of Religion. Maybe part of me is skeptical, right? And her answer was that they'd all been cleaned or treated for conservation purposes. Maybe there's some residual fear that's been built up in me. So I'm trying to build the case-- and for some reason in my research, it kept coming back to Italy and Rome, which is why I focus on Hippolytus. . And this is what I present to the world. So the Eastern Aegean. And anyone who drinks this, [SPEAKING GREEK], Jesus says in Greek, you remain in me and I in you. 101. As a matter of fact, I think it's much more promising and much more fertile for scholarship to suggest that some of the earliest Christians may have availed themselves of a psychedelic sacrament and may have interpreted the Last Supper as some kind of invitation to open psychedelia, that mystical supper as the orthodox call it, [NON-ENGLISH SPEECH]. So somewhere between 1% and 49%. BRIAN MURARESKU: It just happens to show up. And if the latter, do you think there's a good chance that religions will adopt psychedelics back into their rituals?". 283. There were formula. I mean, about 25 years ago, actually. 18.3C: Continuity Theory. So first of all, please tell us how it is you came to pursue this research to write this book, and highlight briefly what you think are its principal conclusions and their significance for our present and future. And this is at a time when we're still hunting and gathering. Now we're getting somewhere. So the closer we get to the modern period, we're starting to find beer, wine mixed with interesting things. These sources suggest a much greater degree of continuity with pre-Christian values and practice than the writings of more . Well, let's get into it then. That also only occurs in John, another epithet of Dionysus. In fact, he found beer, wine, and mead all mixed together in a couple of different places. Part 1 Brian C. Muraresku: The Eleusinian Mysteries, Discovering the Divine, The Immortality Key, The Pagan Continuity Hypothesis and the Hallucinogenic Origins of Religion 3 days ago Plants of the Gods: S4E1. You can see that inscribed on a plaque in Saint Paul's monastery at Mount Athos in Greece. But it survives. So I'm not convinced that-- I think you're absolutely right that what this establishes is that Christians in southern Italy could have-- could have had access to the kinds of things that have been recovered from that drug farm, let's call it. So there's a house preserved outside of Pompeii, preserved, like so much else, under the ash of Mount Vesuvius's eruption in the year 79 of the Common Era. You want to field questions in both those categories? For me, that's a question, and it will yield more questions. She joins me for most events and meetings. So the Greek god of wine, intoxication. The pagan continuity hypothesis at the heart of this book made sense to me. Rupert Sheldrake, PhD, is a biologist and author best known for his hypothesis of morphic resonance. These-- that-- Christians are spread out throughout the eastern Mediterranean, and there are many, many pockets of people practicing what we might call, let's just call it Christian mysticism of some kind. I want to thank you for putting up with me and my questions. So Brian, I wonder, maybe we should give the floor to you and ask you to speak about, what are the questions you think both ancient historians such as myself should be asking that we're not, and maybe what are the sorts of questions that people who aren't ancient historians but who are drawn to this evidence, to your narrative, and to the present and the future of religion, what sort of questions should they be asking regarding psychedelics? And, as always the best way to keep abreast of this series and everything else we do here at the Center is to join our mailing list. And as a lawyer, I know what is probative and what's circumstantial evidence, and I just-- I don't see it there. So let's talk about the future of religion, and specifically the future of Roman Catholicism. I include that line for a reason. There have been breakthroughs, too, which no doubt kept Brian going despite some skepticism from the academy, to say the least. So why do you think psychedelics are so significant that they might usher in a new Reformation? I just sense a great deal of structure and thoughtfulness going into this experience. But maybe you could just say something about this community in Catalonia. And you find terracotta heads that could or could not be representative of Demeter and Persephone, the two goddesses to whom the mysteries of Eleusis were dedicated. And the one thing that unites both of those worlds in this research called the pagan continuity hypothesis, the one thing we can bet on is the sacred language of Greek. CHARLES STANG: So it may be worth mentioning, for those who are attending who haven't read the book, that you asked, who I can't remember her name, the woman who is in charge of the Eleusis site, whether some of the ritual vessels could be tested, only to discover-- tested for the remains of whatever they held, only to learn that those vessels had been cleaned and that no more vessels were going to be unearthed. BRIAN MURARESKU: Right. CHARLES STANG: We're often in this situation where we're trying to extrapolate from evidence from Egypt, to see is Egypt the norm or is it the exception? Listen to #646: Brian C. Muraresku with Dr. Mark Plotkin The Eleusinian Mysteries, Discovering the Divine, The Immortality Key, The Pagan Continuity Hypothesis, Lessons from Scholar Karen Armstrong, and Much More, an episode of The Tim Ferriss Show, easily on Podbay - the best podcast player on the web. I mean, I think the book makes it clear. Now, you could draw the obvious conclusion. And what you're referring to is-- and how I begin the book is this beautiful Greek phrase, [SPEAKING GREEK]. So thank you, all who have hung with us. And inside that beer was all kinds of vegetable matter, like wheat, oats, and sedge and lily and flax and various legumes. Again, if you're attracted to psychedelics, it's kind of an extreme thing, right? But I think there's a decent scientific foothold to begin that work. Books about pagan continuity hypothesis? Although she's open to testing, there was nothing there. 8th century BC from the Tel Arad shrine. And I started reading the studies from Pat McGovern at the University of Pennsylvania. We don't have to look very hard to find that. And did the earliest Christians inherit the same secret tradition? You won't find it in many places other than that. Because again, when I read the clinical literature, I'm reading things that look like mystical experiences, or that at least at least sound like them. And so I can see psychedelics being some kind of extra sacramental ministry that potentially could ease people at the end of life. And how do we-- when the pharmaceutical industry and when these retreat centers begin to open and begin to proliferate, how do we make this sacred? He was wronged by individuals, allegedly. And for some reason, I mean, I'd read that two or three times as an undergrad and just glossed over that line. So this is interesting. CHARLES STANG: All right. And I asked her openly if we could test some of the many, many containers that they have, some on display, and many more in repository there. And they found this site, along with others around the Mediterranean. I don't think we have found it. The only reason I went to college was to study classics. And at the same time, when I see a thirst, especially in young people, for real experience, and I see so many Catholics who do not believe in transubstantiation, obviously, what comes to my mind is how, if at all, can psychedelics enhance faith or reinvent Christianity. Nazanin Boniadi What does that have to do with Christianity? I go out of my way, in both parts of the book, which, it's divided into the history of beer and the history of wine, essentially. But we do know that something was happening. And we know from the record that [SPEAKING GREEK] is described as being so crowded with gods that they were easier to find than men. CHARLES STANG: We've really read Jesus through the lens of his Greek inheritors. Here is how I propose we are to proceed. Tim Ferriss Show #646: Brian C. Muraresku with Dr. Mark Plotkin: The Eleusinian Mysteries, Discovering the Divine, The Immortality Key, The Pagan Continuity Hypothesis, Psychedelics, and More. And by the way, I'm not here trying to protect Christianity from the evidence of psychedelic use. So let's start with one that is more contemporary. There's a moment in the book where you are excited about some hard evidence. Despite its popular appeal as a New York Times Bestseller, TIK fails to make a compelling case for its grand theory of the "pagan continuity hypothesis with a psychedelic twist" due to. Many people see that as symbolic or allegorical or just a nice thing, which is not the case. Here's the proof of concept. Maybe there's a spark of the divine within. I would expect we'd have ample evidence. The Immortality Key, The Secret History of the Religion With No Name. And I'm not even sure what that piece looks like or how big it is. So if you don't think that you are literally consuming divine blood, what is the point of religion? And so I do see an avenue, like I kind of obliquely mentioned, but I do think there's an avenue within organized religion and for people who dedicate their lives as religious professionals to ministry to perhaps take a look at this in places where it might work. Wonderful, well, thank you. Now, it doesn't have to be the Holy Grail that was there at the Last Supper, but when you think about the sacrament of wine that is at the center of the world's biggest religion of 2.5 billion people, the thing that Pope Francis says is essential for salvation, I mean, how can we orient our lives around something for which there is little to no physical data? Because even though it's a very long time ago, Gobekli Tepe, interestingly, has some things in common with Eleusis, like the worship of the grain, the possibility of brewing, the notion of a pilgrimage, and interaction with the dead. This event is entitled, Psychedelics, The Ancient Religion With No Name? Brought to you by They were relevant to me in going down this rabbit hole. It's some kind of wine-based concoction, some kind of something that is throwing these people into ecstasy. And now we have a working hypothesis and some data to suggest where we might be looking. So it wasn't just a random place to find one of these spiked wines. What was being thrown into it? So psychedelics or not, I think it's the cultivation of that experience, which is the actual key. If you are drawn to psychedelics, in my mind, it means you're probably drawn to contemplative mysticism. Now, I've never done them myself, but I have talked to many, many people who've had experience with psychedelics. This notion in John 15:1, the notion of the true vine, for example, only occurs in John. Just imagine, I have to live with me. So frankly, what happens during the Neolithic, we don't know, at least from a scientific vantage. Copyright 2023 President and Fellows of Harvard College. Church of the Saints Faustina and Liberata, view from the outside with the entrance enclosure, at "Sante" place, Capo di Ponte (Italy). So I want to propose that we stage this play in two acts. And does it line up with the promise from John's gospel that anyone who drinks this becomes instantly immortal? But it's not an ingested psychedelic. So my biggest question is, what kind of wine was it? So how does Dionysian revelries get into this picture? He calls it a drug against grief in Greek, [SPEAKING GREEK]. So your presentation of early Christianity inclines heavily toward the Greek world. That's only after Constantine. Did the ancient Greeks use drugs to find God? And keep in mind that we'll drop down into any one of these points more deeply. Now that the pagan continuity hypothesis is defended, the next task is to show that the pagan and proto-Christian ritual sacraments were, in fact, psychedelicbrews. I see a huge need and a demand for young religious clergy to begin taking a look at this stuff. BRIAN MURARESKU: I'm bringing more illumination. Are they rolling their eyes, or are you getting sort of secretive knowing nods of agreement? But things that sound intensely powerful. A rebirth into a new conception of the self, the self's relationship to things that are hard to define, like God. BRIAN MURARESKU: Good one. Dogs, indicative of the Greek goddess Hecate, who, amongst other things was known as the [GREEK], the dog eater. I'm not sure where it falls. They followed Platonic (and other Greeks) philosophy. And there are legitimate scholars out there who say, because John wanted to paint Jesus in the light of Dionysus, present him as the second coming of this pagan God. How does, in other words, how does religion sit with science? And if there's historical precedent for it, all the more so. Show Plants of the Gods: Hallucinogens, Healing, Culture and Conservation podcast, Ep Plants of the Gods: S4E2. I wish the church fathers were better botanists and would rail against the specific pharmacopeia. And what it has to do with Eleusis or the Greek presence in general, I mean, again, just to say it briefly, is that this was a farmhouse of sorts that was inland, this sanctuary site. This an absolute masterclass on why you must know your identity and goals before forming a habit, what the best systems are for habit. It was-- Eleusis was state-administered, a somewhat formal affair. BRIAN MURARESKU: OK. Interesting. And Dennis, amongst others, calls that a signature Dionysian miracle. This discussion on Febrary 1, 2021, between CSWR Director Charles Stang and Brian Muraresku about his new book, The Immortality Key: The Secret History of the Religion with No Name,a groundbreaking dive into the role of psychedelics in the ancient Mediterranean world. I wish that an ancient pharmacy had been preserved by Mount Vesuvius somewhere near Alexandria or even in upper Egypt or in Antioch or parts of Turkey. Now-- and I think that we can probably concede that. You may have already noticed one such question-- not too hard. OK, Brian, I invite you to join us now. Brian is the author of a remarkable new book that has garnered a lot of attention and has sold a great many copies. And if it's one thing Catholicism does very, very well, it's contemplative mysticism. BRIAN MURARESKU: Great question. And yet I talked to an atheist who has one experience with psilocybin and is immediately bathed in God's love. And when I read psychedelic literature or I read the literature on near-death experiences, I see experiences similar to what I experienced as a young boy. I mean, I asked lots of big questions in the book, and I fully acknowledge that. We see lots of descriptions of this in the mystical literature with which you're very familiar. So I have my concerns about what's about to happen in Oregon and the regulation of psilocybin for therapeutic purposes. It is not psychedelics. The most colorful theory of psychedelics in religion portrays the original Santa Claus as a shaman. The continuity hypothesis of dreams suggests that the content of dreams are largely continuous with waking concepts and concerns of the dreamer. And I'm trying to reconcile that. I'm trying to get him to speak in the series about that. would certainly appreciate. After the first few chapters the author bogs down flogging the Pagan Continuity Hypothesis and exulting over his discovery of small scraps of evidence he found in a decade of research. Now, I've had experiences outside the Eucharist that resonate with me. Throughout his five books he talks about wine being mixed with all kinds of stuff, like frankincense and myrrh, relatively innocuous stuff, but also less innocuous things like henbane and mandrake, these solanaceous plants which he specifically says is fatal. When there's a clear tonal distinction, and an existing precedent for Christian modification to Pagan works, I don't see why you're resistant to the idea, and I'm curious . And maybe in these near-death experiences we begin to actually experience that at a visceral level. But by and large, no, we don't really know. CHARLES STANG: So in some sense, you're feeling almost envy for the experiences on psychedelics, which is to say you've never experienced the indwelling of Christ or the immediate knowledge of your immortality in the sacrament. I understand the appeal of that. We're going to get there very soon. I imagine there are many more potion makers around than we typically recognize. I think it's important you have made a distinction between what was Jesus doing at the Last Supper, as if we could ever find out. Now you're a good sport, Brian. Newsweek calls him 'the world's best human guinea pig,' and The New York Times calls him 'a cross between Jack Welch and a Buddhist monk.' In this show, he deconstructs world-class performers from eclectic areas (investing, chess, pro sports, etc . We have some inscriptions. And if it only occurs in John, the big question is why. Lots of Greek artifacts, lots of Greek signifiers. A combination of psychoactive plants, including opium, cannabis, and nightshade, along with the remains of reptiles and amphibians all steeped in wine, like a real witch's brew, uncovered in this house outside of Pompeii. So whatever was happening there was important. The Gnostics did have continuity with paganism. Despite its popular appeal as a New York Times Bestseller, TIK fails to make a compelling case for its grand theory of the "pagan continuity hypothesis with a psychedelic twist" due to recurring overreach and historical distortion, failure to consider relevant research on shamanism and Christianity, and presentation of speculation as fact."